No, I don't think it will be either. I've seen her a few times on TV and it's easy to disconnect yourself from thesr things, esp as they happened before our lifetimes. But when you hear her speak about him, it's pretty heartbreaking.

Would this be a really inappropriate place to say how glad I am, however, that Britain doesn't have capital punishment? I think it's a far more dignified response to horrific things like this. The courtroom scene in the drama brought that one back to me.

i'm probably more barbaric in the sense that i'm glad she had to endure years of abuse from other prisoners.

That's a lot different from Karly Kurls who was ~queen of teh prison~

Well, yes, I can def. see that, too. Sorry, I know I'm saying this in the wrong place, but it doesn't need saying that people like Brady (and Hindley) and Ian Hunter are either in severe need of help of thoroughly awful people or a mix. I just don't think it demonstrates anything good or vaguely righteous that the state takes their lives. Okay sorry! I'm off to nick some more of my flatmate's vino...

I enjoyed the programme, it was really well handled and perfectly cast. I was pleased to see Hindley not portrayed as some evil witch. Not that I sympathise for her crimes, I just disagree with the way she has become the image of evil to society.

Well, yes. It's sort-of the same as Maxine Carr (whose name I deliberately left off when I was on about Ian Huntley). Horrendous as Hindley and Carr's actions were, whose name do you always remember? The women's. I had to sit for a minute to think of his name, whereas her's came to mind instantly (and he was the killer). And it's totally because it's so shocking that a woman could do such things.

but as was pointed out, brady is a psychopath. myra wasn't crazy.

and she was able to lure children because they trusted her. they knew to run away from a strange man who approached them, but not a woman.

feminism has nowt to do with it.

Okay. I just remember my A Level sociology teacher telling us what I rattled off to you about women. I don't actually know much about it.

But I mean, Maxine Carr and Ian Huntley. I think everyone remembers her name and face far worse than his. And all she did was cover for him. OBVIOUSLY not that I'm excusing her actions in the least. They're just not comparable, I mean.

Well actually it IS to do with feminism... We asume a role of maternal instinct, care and trust of women, so for Hindley to exploit that by luring the children creates her back into the age old witch category. But WHY do we just presume that all women have those characteristics? Why do we always tell our children to find a woman with a pushchair if they are lost? Why not a man with a pushchair? That is a consequence of conditioning which goes hand in hand with feminist ideology.

Brady was mentally ill and Hindley wasn't, and in no way am I saying she should be made out like a victim herself, but people will act very differently when they are in love. If a person is insecure or vulnerable like she obviously was, then they'll do ANYTHING to keep that person, they become absorbed inside this ideal world and reality becomes more and more distant, it becomes a fantasy.

Maxine Carr is a different story though, and I hate to see her lumped into the Moors Murders story because Ian Huntley and Maxine Carr, were not the 'new' Ian Brady and Myra Hindley. She lied, she didn't lure. She was stupid not manipulative.

I don't know. It's a HUGE sociological issue, the whole murder, evil and the media, and I can't be bothered to write a really thought out post. But God does the phrase 'Stand By Your Man' ever spring to mind.

Like Furlisitea said the difference between carr and hindley is that hindley killed carr only lied to the police because she thought huntley was innocent wrong as her actions were she didnt actually kill/ bury anyone. Although the way the press talk about her she might as well have.

Ooooh this is why I tried to point out I don't know the ins-and-outs!!

But, YES. What Furlisitea said is what I remember my teacher saying. I just couldn't be that articulate about it.

well yes, i was wrong to say it's got nothing to do with feminism, but if i was more articulate i would have made it clear that i meant i don't care about the fact that she was so hated because she was a woman. as in that simple fact doesn't make me sympathise with her, or think how wrong the media and the public were to dislike her.

Jesus...and I was expecting a nice little intimate thread. Good to see that people tuned in.

In the end, it was amazing, absolutely horrific but amazing. Maxine Peake did a great job, as I said before she really got that "downward spiral into child-killing hell" to a T(Tee?). Sean Harris was also good but then again he generally does play these types of roles whereas Maxine is usually involved in the comic side of thangs. The other performances were really commendable too, I really can't get over the talent that's present in Britain yet isn't really availed of...if you know what I mean.

Was anyone else pissed off to no end when the "corrupt" police wouldn't search for the remaining bodies? I mean, did they have no fucking conscience? Well then again, Police can tend to be like that, especially the Gardai over here.

Anywho, last of all, I think the families should be commended for letting this film go ahead. I can't imagine the suffering they went through.

Huzzah for the programme and let's never forget those children.

I agree. They knew Hindley and Brady had more than likely killed Pauline and Keith, yet didn't want to look for them. Pauline's family at least could have gotten justice then, instead of waiting until 1987. I think they should still be looking for Keith, his poor mum has never given up hope of giving him a proper burial and I don't know how long she has left.

I remember a while back, The Sun printed a transcription of the audio recording Hindley and Brady made of Lesley Ann as they molested, tortured and killed her. It's the most harrowing thing I have ever read and it has stayed with me, also it proves just how involved Hindley was. She wasn't just there to lure children in, she did have an active role, even if it was only to please Brady.

i really enjoyed See No Evil, it was good that they did it from the perseptive of her sister so it was all based on fact and not assumption, it was very tastfully done.

I have to get my hands on a copy of that transcription, if that sounds sick, I apologise.

Yes, Myra was actively involved even as you said, if it was just to please Ian. He was obviously very charismatic just like one of his role-models, Hitler. He lured Myra in and she took the bait. Then again, Myra completely immersed herself in Ian's world and she did some very, very evil thangs. Does anyone remember where Maureen visits Myra and Myra is desperate for her forgiveness and she admits she's done wrong yet she didn't exactly confess to killing the children......then

In 1987, she admits to it, 7 years after Maureen died. Just goes to show you, she had in no way completely redeemed herself. I just hope she died with a clear conscience. Was there any documentaries made soon after Myra died in 2002?

I saw a documentary about Myra Hindley a few years back, and all she would ever really confess to was 'luring' the victims, leaving Brady to do the rest. She insisted she was deeply remorseful but remorseful for what? She claimed he alone was responsible for abusing, raping and killing the victims, whilst she painted herself as something of a lovestruck, even reluctant accomplice/bystander.

I accept that he was the 'leader' and that he corrupted her, and that she unfairly came to be seen as the more 'evil' of the two, just because she was a woman. But there's good reason to doubt Hindley's claim about her level of participation in the crimes themselves - the most powerful (and terrifying) evidence against them during their trial was a tape recording made shortly before the murder of one of their victims, a 10 year old girl. On the recording the poor little girl was begging God to save her and crying for her mother, and neither Brady nor Hindley responded on the tape with the slightest trace of pity or compassion. On the contrary, they both shouted at her, threatened her, and repeatedly ordered her to undress and pose for obscene photographs. I've never heard this recording (thank God - I hope it never ends up on the internet) but from every description I've heard or read, there is nothing on it that makes Hindley sound like a reluctant participant, acting under duress or even like she was Brady's mere accomplice.
At best it makes her appear to have been as equally depraved and psychotic as he was.

My point is, the recording is the only tangible proof of what happened after their victims were abducted. Ie, who did what? Was it all just Brady or was it Brady AND Hindley? And it goes completely against Hindley's claim that it was all just Brady!

As I mentioned, she could have temporarily become as psychotic as Brady - I do think they were both likely to have been suffering Folie a` deux ('shared madness' or 'communicated madness').

'Folie a` deux' is a controversial psychiatric theory but the theory goes that one 'dominant', psychotic mind 'infects' a passive, impressionable mind until the latter shares the psychosis of the former. Anybody familiar with it would probably agree with me when I say, Brady and Hindley showed all the hallmarks of a case of Folie a` deux.
And the TV movie sounds pretty good. I hope it's shown here.

There's a copy (edited, I don't think the whole thing was ever released) of the transcript here: http://www.missstrict.net/downey.html Be warned, that site is pretty fucked up

i really enjoyed this, although i did not watch the first part in full, i thought the way they made it was very respectful.
Joanne Froggart, who plays Maureen is a bloody good actress too, I thought. She was fab in Corrie too!