Originally Posted by petals

the implication that they were lovers was a bit weird and out of place - like it's shifting the blame outside 'normative'.

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Originally Posted by Sara_KidA

I very much liked Elephant but I'm just a big admirer of Gus Van Sant.

I've felt that with him you either hate his style or you love it. Loads of people don't seem to have the patience to sit through his movies...I feel like they're missing out BIG TIME.

His use of music is also quite extraordinary

Originally Posted by ironhills

Actually, I thought the point of making them lovers was to solidify their pact with each other.

Originally Posted by ironhills

Actually, I thought the point of making them lovers was to solidify their pact with each other.

Originally Posted by petals

i thought it was boring and stupid and i thought the implication that they were lovers was a bit weird and out of place - like it's shifting the blame outside 'normative'.

Originally Posted by Manhattan

I felt like it was too sensationalist for my tastes at first (what with the Hitler biopic, the first time gay sex in the shower, the buying guns off of the Internet, etc.) but I separated myself from it for a second and felt myself caught in the middle of two extreme viewpoint stuck in themselves and I felt torn by the movie. And then I felt like I was really into the movie because i put that aside and it was plain weird.

When the loner girl got shot in the library I almost screamed "Oh what the fuck!?" and I bawled. I felt so strange because I was thinking about how oddly close to these people I felt. I guess you don't need wild, exciting, or humorous things to happen to someone to form some sort of connection with.

Bizarre movie, sticks with me still.


I never felt fully connected to those people who felt REALLY sorry for the boys who did it in almost every way. I mean, they chose to do it in and of themselves. They chose it, not the video games or TV or Hitler or the guns, it was them who opened fire.
Regardless of that, there's no way to prove that they would've done it regardless of the media now. It's like that guy who did his own little part two of Taxi Driver, the seed was already planted in that guy (so to speak), it wasn't as if by avoiding watching the movie Taxi Driver he wouldn't have attempted to kill someone. If you're influenced by TV, movies, games, etc. to the point that you would kill because of its influence then i think you're weak-minded and shouldn't be allow to get a slap on the wrist.

It's the same with Columbine or VT, it's your particular interests in entertainment and information media that expand onto other horizons in the same sort of vein as that beginning interest. If you didn't like what you saw in a horror movie then you wouldn't watch it. If someone forced you to watch it enough times to be brainwashed to kill someone gruesomely then I probably wouldn't mind letting them go (under treatment). But when you actively seek out media like this then don't complain that it made you do it. You're the one who never flipped the channel when you saw that there was a show on Hitler on TV, and you're the one who bought the violent video games, etc. I mean, it's lame for people to have to come up with reasons for why these people are complete douchebags. There shouldn't be any tip-toeing around it. They did it to themselves. You can always change your subconscious mind, and just because it's harder than going with it doesn't excuse you from mass murder.

BTW, I'm not saying that everyone who likes horror movies are murderers or people who consider committing murder seriously, but there are different ways to enjoy a horror movie and there are people who don't enjoy them at all. There are those few who enjoy them in a way that it gives them something to look forward to re-creating or drawing on inspiration to act upon.

It's too bad we don't have the Elephant thread from 2 years ago. Great discussion.

[/longassinsomniacrant]

Originally Posted by HighClassHo

people like you is the reason why after 5 thousand years of civilization we are still douchebags.

Whenever something like Virgina Tech of Columbine happens, I ask myself what are WE doing that causes this?? I'm not justifying what they did because it has no excuse, and they are obviously metally ill people, but you look into their lives and you realize for example, they were bullied at school. And they were not the only kids on earth that were bullied, I was bullied and thousands of other people were also bullied. So I don't get stuck on defending the media or vilifying this people, I already know they are crazy. I simply ask myself, why are we like this?? why do we have to bully people?? why must there always be a scapegoat of some kind?? a wicked witch of the east? those are MY questions.


As for the movie, it's one of the worst movies I've seen in my life. It has no plot, you don't get to know or sympathize with anyone, it's incredibly boring, I mean I don't care if that was the point, it was an incredibly lame movie.

I don't care what people say but the best Gus Van Sant movie is To Die For. I think it's the only one of his "works" that can be considered a film, and a very innovative and different film it is. It's an amazing movie.

Originally Posted by mannequin

i thought maybe the shower scene was there to show how they were never going to experience that because they knew they were going to die maybe?

Originally Posted by ironhills

was to solidify their pact with each other.

Originally Posted by VenusDeMilo

Someone told me if I liked Amelie, I would like Elephant.
I'd like to meet that person again and ask why. And then punch them in the face for being a filthy liar.

Originally Posted by PuertoRicanHappyFan

that = sex right? If so, I really really like your take on it.
Although I do agree with it meaning

Originally Posted by HighClassHo

I don't care what people say but the best Gus Van Sant movie is To Die For. I think it's the only one of his "works" that can be considered a film, and a very innovative and different film it is. It's an amazing movie.