We're skeptical. We read Snopes and the Straight Dope. We don't mistake Hollywood for a history book.

But every now and then, some random fact we've believed for a long time is proved wrong, wrong, wrong. Like today. We looked up famous Seattleite Frances Farmer on Wikipedia (no, certainly not to write trivia questions about her, why do you ask?) and noticed a section called "the false lobotomy claims."

Frances Farmer didn't get a lobotomy!?

But...but...it was in Shadowland! And the Jessica Lange movie! And Hollywood wouldn't lie...d'oh!

Then again, it's not like Wikipedia's an unimpeachable source, right? So we checked HistoryLink, and they say the same thing:

The allegation that Farmer was lobotomized was advanced by Seattle writer William Arnold in his 1978 book Shadowland, amplified by the 1982 film Frances, and has since been widely accepted as fact. However, Farmer’s family, friends, and others insist she did not undergo a lobotomy, by Freeman or anyone else.
She says she didn't get one. The guy who supposedly gave her one says he didn't do it. The author of Shadowland admits it was, um, fictionalized. Supporting details indicate that she didn't get one.

Frances Farmer wasn't lobotomized. You learn something new every day. We're happy to have this illusion shattered -- yay, brain integrity! -- but there's nothing like that suckered feeling when you find out you've believed bunk for years.

No, she does so STILL need revenge on Seattle! I can't figure out why people think her experiences weren't bad enough without the fictitious lobotomy! Oh, and there were apparently no 'soldiers' sneaking in gang~raping her, (thank God) although somebody (one of her 'adopted nieces' I think?) said she was indeed sexually abused in the hospital, though fortunately not THAT badly ...

I've read that article 'debunking' Shadowland (a book I'd love to read but can't find; I only read her alleged autobiography. It's VERY hard to believe Farmer didn't write a word of it. Farmer's nephew, in one of those E! Hollywood documentaries, implied she DID write a little of it ~ the well~written bits. I've read some examples of her writing and she definitely had writing talent.)

ANYway yes, the author of Shadowland was a Scientologist (she said wearily) and in his quest to make psychiatry out to be innately evil he apparently wildly embellished Frances' horrific experiences ... which really didn't need to be embellished at all ~ her experiences in the mental asylum were atrocious.
Electric shock, insulin, and (if I remember correctly) hydrotherapy too (would that be the 'ice baths'?). For years and years without any real proof she was actually mentally ill.
Her major problem was simply alcohol. The meltdown that surpassed all other movie star meltdowns ("HAVEN'T I GOT ANY CIVIL RIGHTS? RATS! RATS! RATS!") was also brought on by one too many benzedrine benders. I suspect.
Great topic any way! I love you!

oh noes clove is gonna hafta rewrite her own personal mythology. drat.

The guy who did the Shadowlands debunking wrote on IMDB that he had the 'pleasure' (his scare quotes) of meeting Courtney circa 2004. She had time to rewrite it, or at least get it down pat in time for THAT 40th birthday.

Why make something like that up?

she's wrote her own autobiography, (it really good) you can't really do that if you've had a lobotomy, and a lobotomy is never even mentioned in the whole book.

What, no lobotomy? For shame! I demand a full refund on my copy of In Utero.

Exactly

She needed the attention. And the legend. And immortalisation in song. Thus: RESULT.

I thought about that the whole way through the book- how could she recall all this stuff as a lobotomized person?!

i'd really like to read about her. do you think her bio is the wsy to go or is there a better book?

she had a frontal lobotomy, it is different than the lobotomies you may be familiar with. She was zombie like after, not a total vegetable. She could talk. It was not a science, by performing the barbaric procedure, they did not magically erase memory of the procedure and other nasty things but manage to just stick pins in her brain and fiddle about, THAT is the fucked up part. Some of you are acting like lobotomies work, or are somehow all the same. You know they are outlawed now (in America) , they do not fucking work.


And to you people who say she was doing it for attention, jesus christ you have a low opinion of humanity, or is it just women? Or artists? Not to mention, she did not get a chance to write all of her autiobiograhpy, she died.

yes, I know youre joking

"Will there ever be a morning" is a great book. But the Jessica Lang movie is still my favourite source! Seriously

Have I ever mentioned that this thread has the best title ever?

Thanks Bort ! ................... B O R T Y!!

Frances Farmer had SHOCK TREATMENTS, and was raped repeatedly by interns at the facility in which she was kept and others who paid to fuck her. The labotomy shit was all for the drama effect.

By the way, did 'we' mention you post writings like a faggot ass Truman Capote on drugs that didn't exist before he died?

If you did. It's your own personal opinion. It's not such a great title.

I can;t be arsed to read hte thread, but the title is genious